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new molecule to switch off appetite found - sodium acetate

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 Posted 6/27/2014 3:59:18 AM
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A local health food store is selling sodium acetate now.  Others in the local area are now trying it.  More data points on dosing are beginning to emerge.

Myself, I have now lost about 25 lbs since the first week in May.  My need for sodium acetate has diminished greatly.  In the beginning I was doing 1/3-1/2 TSP (rounded) a couple of times per day when hungry.  Now, it is either none, or just a "pea sized" chunk of crystals since the body has become accustomed to reduced calorie intake.

The 1/3-1/2 rounded TSP dose seemed to be effective for me in the beginning.  However, I have been dieting or trying to for years, and this has reduced my metabolism.  Also take LEF Anti-Adipocyte, cinnamon, Tri-Sugar Shield, Bitter Melon, etc.  Maybe these and/or my reduced metabolism allowed the 1/3-1/2 rounded TSP to be enough to start me off?

Feedback from others, often 20-somethings and 30-somethings, with higher metabolisms have found that the 1/3-1/2 rounded TSP may not be enough, since acetate is rapidly metabolized by the body, especially if they work out too.  They may need as much as 1 rounded TSP, maybe twice a day as a guide.  Even better, dissolving a couple of rounded TSP in a drinking water bottle, and just sipping it when hungry may be a much better solution.  That way you effectively having a time-release method, requiring less total sodium acetate then taking two large 1 TSP doses. Sodium acetate is highly antimicrobial, so nothing is going to grow in that water bottle.

--ghg


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 Posted 6/30/2014 3:21:59 AM
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Update 6/30/14. Sublingual sodium acetate

I have noticed for a "touch up" small dose, size of a pea or smaller, that when it is dissolved in the mouth and under the tongue seems to go into the blood much faster (a couple of minutes) than when it is swallowed (in liquid).  Somebody will probably come out with sodium acetate "lozenges" now.

For larger doses, bigger than a pea sized chunk, such as seems to be needed by younger people with very active metabolisms, I would still dissolve it in water and drink, or put in a water bottle, and sip as needed.

A minor side effect, not caused by the sodium acetate, but by the rapid loss of fat:

I take a lot of vitamin D3,  two 50,000 IU pills per week (take pill apart and dump the powder into olive oil first).  Plus whatever is in the LEF "mix" 9 per day multivitamin.  Between LEF blood labs and local doctor blood labs, I get my D3 level (25-hydroxy-vitamin D) checked 4 times per year.  I have maintained an optimal level of high 40's or low 50's ng/ml. Since D3 is stored in fat, and at the time of the last lab, there was suddenly 20 lbs less fat, the stored D3 was dumped into the blood, bringing my level to almost 80 ng/ml.  I as long as I am rapidly dropping weight, I have stopped the high dose vitamin D3

--ghg


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 Posted 7/10/2014 4:36:33 AM
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More feedback.

Myself, since losing a bunch of weight, I am beginning to get more active (also taking coconut oil), that raises my metabolism, and as expected, the "pea" size piece of sodium acetate is no longer enough.  I am now back to 1/2 rounded TSP, twice a day.

Feedback from 30-somethings who are very active (work out), but are slim, and who have huge cravings, are trying sodium acetate, and they need about 1 rounded TSP once or twice a day, and it kills their huge cravings.  Since they are not fat, they will probably not lose any weight, but at least it stops the cravings.

--ghg


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 Posted 7/21/2014 11:10:17 AM
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Another tidbit,  I have found that putting two rounded TSP of sodium acetate into a 20oz water bottle seems to work well for me.  It is just sipped as needed. The taste is no too strong.  Usually lasts for 2-3 days.

By taking sodium acetate (contains no chlorine atom), sodium bicarbonate  (no chlorine), potassium bicarbonate (no chlorine), and cutting out snacks, and greatly reducing food intake, I sometimes got low sodium, and probably low blood chloride as well.  The food not eaten, greatly reduced my common salt (sodium chloride) intake.  I had supplemented with sodium/potassium, but had forgotten about the chloride.  So I added 2-3 "62mg" magnesium chloride pills/day in addition to regular magnesium supplements.  I think the chloride component of this tablet is 456mg.  So a couple of those did it. Potassium chloride should allow more chloride.   This way I keep up my chloride without having to eat more plain salt.

Running on reduced food intake has some nutrition challenges.  One MUST take a good multi vitamin like "LEF mix" 9 per day.

--ghg


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 Posted 8/1/2014 4:58:23 AM
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GHG sodium acetate diet.

This is a summary of what I have learned about sodium acetate and a diet that makes use of it over the summer.

I am not a medical doctor, and none of this is medical advice. None of these statements have been evaluated by the US FDA.  Consult your own doctor before trying any of this.

Sodium acetate does not make you lose weight.  It only suppresses your appetite. This allows you to come up with your own diet to consume less food and lose weight.

There is an ongoing forum thread at the Life Extension Foundation (LEF). I started that thread in the middle of May 2014.

http://ask.lef.org/12821/  (this thread)

Here is what GHG does as a guideline:

Obtain FCC grade (food grade) sodium acetate from your local health food store or the internet.

The dosage is highly dependent on your metabolism.  Very low metabolism people may only need 1/4 rounded TSP, once or twice a day.  Average people often need about 1/2 rounded TSP once or twice a day.  High metabolism people, such as 20-somethings and 30-somethings may need as much as 1 TSP once or twice a day, especially if they work out at the gym.

For me, I dissolve two rounded TSPs of sodium acetate into a 20oz water bottle and sip as needed.  The bottle usually lasts three days.  Sodium acetate is an antimicrobial, so nothing (bacteria) should grow in the water bottle.  I just take a sip (gulp) when hunger appears, usually after the small breakfast. I take a smaller sip after lunch when hunger appears. This usually shuts off my appetite for up to 5 hours (no "will power" needed).  I even reduced my exercise, stopped climbing six flights of stairs, since my weight was going down so fast.  I have lost 30 lbs between the 2nd week of May 2014, and the end of July 2014.

Many 20-somethings and 30-somethings are not fat, but have huge hunger cravings to stay that way. Sodium acetate will kill those cravings, and they can continue to eat as they normally do.

When you greatly reduce your food intake, it is mandatory to take supplements.  First of all, modern food, especially processed food, has a greatly reduced  amount of nutrients.  Even farm produce (especially non organic), has much lower nutrient amounts (especially magnesium) than they did before mass agriculture took off.  Mega farms only use the minimum fertilizer to make the plants grow, but they are often nearly devoid of nutrients when eaten. Organic/local grown is usually much better.  So when one cuts their food intake by 1/2 or more (try to stay above 1,000 calories/day), nutrition deficiencies become more pronounced.

GHG takes these:

Multivitamin:
LEF "Mix 315", that is a 9 tablets per day (3 per meal) supplement, probably the world's most complete multivitamin.

http://www.lef.org/vitamins-supplements/item01855/Life-Extension-Mix-Tablets.html

After two months on sodium acetate, I probably developed a chloride deficiency. None of my supplements contained the chloride anion.  Reducing food intake reduced ordinary salt (sodium chloride) intake. Sodium acetate has some sodium, but no chloride, so my chloride ended up low. I hit a weight loss plateau (lost no weight) for about two weeks in the middle of July, but the sodium acetate still suppressed appetite. Once I started taking the magnesium chloride supplement (below), weight loss immediately resumed.

The chloride deficiency was assumed, based on no chlorides in my other supplements, greatly reduced salt intake.  References in medical literature indicate that people who regularly eat baking soda or take antacids can be short on the chloride anion.  Sodium acetate just metabolizes into baking soda, so it was a high probability.  Metabolism is also dependent on enough chloride anion being present. My metabolism increased significantly as soon as magnesium chloride was started.

I have taken LEF "500mg Magnesium Caps", three times/day for years as well as 3 per day of LEF Magnesium L-Threonate (got rid of all my brain fog!)

I purchased a magnesium chloride supplement locally (LEF does not carry this).  It contains 518mg of magnesium chloride (62mg magnesium, 456mg chloride). Take it  three per day, one per meal. Don't do more than one per meal or you will probably  get diarrhea.

I feel that it is MANDATORY TO TAKE A MAGNESIUM CHLORIDE SUPPLEMENT with sodium acetate.

The chloride form of magnesium has many other benefits I have found out.

See:

http://drsircus.com/medicine/magnesium/

http://drcarolyndean.com/magnesium_miracle/

You should also probably take potassium and calcium supplements too. You need more magnesium than calcium to make the calcium behave properly.  DDye and others have recommended that calcium and magnesium supplements not be taken at the same time, but spaced out a few hours.

Here is a typical food intake for GHG in a day.

Breakfast.

1 medium to small size apple.
30g (heaping scoop) of LEF whey protein
http://www.lef.org/Vitamins-Supplements/Item01742/

A gulp or two from the 20oz bottle of sodium acetate solution described above.

Lunch

Small "thin" pepperoni & jalapeno pizza.
20g LEF whey protein.

Sodium acetate, but usually less than at breakfast.
Just sip when hungry.

Dinner

4-5 cherry tomatoes, or one regular fresh
tomato, with 2-3 TBSP of cheddar cheese.

10g of LEF whey protein.

I have no hunger after dinner, so no sodium acetate.

I also take a TSP of coconut oil, three times/day.

I also take 6 per meal, LEF Super-Omega3 fish oil tabs, which gives me perfect lipids, and greatly cuts back inflammation.

http://www.lef.org/Vitamins-Supplements/Item01482/

Other fish oil brands don't contain Sesame Lignans and olive fruit extracts to inhibit lipid peroxidation and suppress the conversion of Omega-6s already in the body into the far more inflammatory AA (Arachidonic Acid).

Your mileage may vary.

--ghg 8/1/2014


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 Posted 8/26/2014 3:50:17 AM
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It is well known that saturated fat can reduce hunger cravings.  I had been taking maybe three TSP of extra virgin coconut oil over the day.  However, they were at times when I wasn't hungry.  Reportedly, coconut oil (a fully saturated fat - medium chain triglycerides) usually makes one lose weight, since the metabolism is raised enough to burn more calories than is in the eaten coconut oil.  In the Philippines, coconut oil was fed to cattle and hogs to try and fatten them up.  They lost weight instead.

My peak hunger cravings are right after the small breakfast (small apple + LEF Whey protein), I become ravenous then.  That is when I use most of my intake of sodium acetate.  As an experiment, I skipped one of my coconut oil (one TSP) servings, when I was not hungry, and took that coconut oil just before the small breakfast instead.  It worked, took a bite out of the hunger, but not completely.  Used only about 1/3-1/2 of the normal sodium acetate as I would have without the coconut oil.  No change in food intake, just adjusted the timing of the coconut oil.

--ghg


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 Posted 8/29/2014 10:01:26 AM
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Sodium acetate does not possess the anti-glycemic properties of vinegar in individuals with type 2 diabetes

Carol S Johnston and Cindy Gaas

Nutrition, Arizona State University, 7001 E. Williams Field Road, Mesa, AZ, 85212 

 http://www.fasebj.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/21/6/A1084-d?sid=5e21290f-c078-4aba-a957-c8f9511a5423      

My further testing seems to confirm this also.  Still need real vinegar to suppress a high glycemic meal.

I wonder if anybody tried "sodium diacetate", which is sodium acetate that has "caged" a molecule of acetic acid (vinegar)?

--ghg             
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 Posted 9/15/2014 11:36:19 AM
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As mentioned earlier, sodium acetate probably caused a low serum chloride, so I began supplementing with magnesium chloride a  month or so ago.  It immediately took care of the low chloride, plus has numerous other benefits mentioned earlier in this thread.  So, I have been taking 4 per day magnesium chloride (62 mg magnesium + 458 mg of chloride per pill), plus 3 pills per day of LEF 160 mg magnesium citrate plus 3 pills per day of LEF magnesium threonate (144 mg mag).  Big boost to overall health still.  To be sure I wasn't over doing it, I used an LEF "RBC magnesium" blood test lab two days ago.  RBC (red blood cell) magnesium is reported to be a far better indication of your magnesium status than serum magnesium according to Dr Sircus (http://drsircus.com).  The reference range is 4.2-6.8  mg/dL.  Mine was 4.3 .. just above the low limit.

I am changing over to Ancient-Minerals brand magnesium chloride flakes.. Several doctors say they are the best monitored for purity, even though they are sold for "bath flakes"..  I am gonna dish out maybe 1/4 TSP, twice a day (morning and evening), and take a magnesium chloride pill at lunch.  I will probably dissolve the flakes in water.  Dr Sircus says RDA for men is about 420 mg magnesium/day.  Optimal might be twice that.  It is real hard to overload on magnesium, since one gets diarrhea first.  Sodium acetate is still working.

--ghg
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 Posted 9/15/2014 2:10:40 PM
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Sodium acetate might have some use if one wanted to go on a calorie restricted diet, that is one proven method in many animals for extending life. But as you point out, you'd have to make sure to consume adequate vitamins and nutrients otherwise such a diet could cause more harm than benefit.
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 Posted 9/24/2014 1:04:50 PM
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This is very interesting. I made some sodium acetate two days ago and used it all day yesterday in water.

The water solution didnt' completely kill my appetite. I boiled the water off and then started taking the crystals yesterday afternoon. This works much better at suppression for me. I can sometimes tell the hunger is there-but its very muted. I took a small amount last night before dinner, and found that absolutely killed my appetite from about 5pm to 8 am this morning.   I have cut out snacks and am watching portions.

I used the crystals all day today. i seem to need more than a pea size amount-I think Ive taken about a tablespoon today.I am mid-40's with about 25 pounds to lose. I have a sedentary job but exercise every day for 30-60 minutes, and take strenous 2 hour dance classes 3 times a week. 

I am weary of becoming vitamin deficient so I started with mag oil last night. I take b vits, and some other supps but nothing for weight management.

I am hoping this will help me continually control my appetite so I can lose weight and move my body's setpoint which is what I am REALLY interested in. NOTHING else works. I lose a few pounds, eating sensibly and moving my body, then I gain it all back.

Thanks for sharing your info ghg2.
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