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HaHa: Vegetarians Less Healthy

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 Posted 4/4/2014 5:24:24 AM
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"Eat food, not too much, mostly plants." Indeed, Will, that is some very wise diet advice from Michael Pollan. I like what the authors of this article Can We Say What Diet Is Best for Health? have to say about all the different diets: "If as a society we were genuinely interested in consensus about the best dietary pattern, rather than a never-ending parade of beauty pageant contestants, the compatibilities and complementarities of all reasonable candidates for best diet would be fairly evident". . .
and then goes on to say, "Given the energy density of meat relative to most plants, even this translates to a diet that is, by bulk, mostly plants."
Even the most paleo of diets would still have been 50% or greater plant-based, it says!

Personally, I prefer the Mediterranean diet, the Okinawan diet, the Himalayan diet, the Indian Kerala diet. . .   just so long as it is a variety of nutritious foods comprised primarily of slow-to digest plant material. . . and more than anything else, the key is to remember to back away from the table early, long before arriving at satiety (now, that's the hard part!).
 
I would add that the diet that most western-industrial countries are known for as being so detrimental today once had diets that were once far more decent.  I stayed every summer as a teenager on my grandparents' farm and learned from them how to appreciate the subtle flavors of food. They ate using the wisdom they had from their very long-lived parents and grandparents.  A large percentage of what they ate was something they themselves had raised or traded with neighbors; whole foods entirely, meat was more often used as a minor ingredient or just a flavoring.  Most cooking was done with slow-cook methods with water or steam-based cooking. Starch was probably a bit more than ideal, but even their starch-based foods were different in that they cooked them less than is common today: fresh corn-on-the cob was steamed for all of about 90 seconds and eaten half-cooked by standards today, potatoes were only served mashed on special occasions;  potatoes, any other day were somewhat semi-hard, with a lower glycemic-index value simply due to less cooking; oatmeal wasn't at all this instant-starch flavored and sugared that is popular today, it was a course-ground mash cooked and served with just a touch of cream and a few drops of honey.   







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 Posted 4/4/2014 6:29:33 AM
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Will Brink, I liked very much the balanced approach of that article. Thank you for having shared it with us. Time ago I found also an extensive comparison study in Europe (for the French readers), here: http://www.anses.fr/Documents/NUT2009sa0099Ra.pdf  You might also find it interesting.

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 Posted 4/4/2014 3:48:55 PM
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Just eyeballing those %'s table #3 in the original publication, it seems to me that overall the healthiest people (as measured by the least chronic conditions) are those in the "carnivorous diet rich in fruits and vegetables" and "carnivorous diet less rich in meat". They are neither the extreme "vegetarian" nor "carnivorous diet rich in meat". In other words, it is once again demonstrated for all the diet fads of the eras, a balanced one is best. It always-always comes back to that.
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 Posted 4/4/2014 10:08:12 PM
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Will Brink (4/2/2014)



To be clear, such a study has serious limitations as to what can really be concluded from it (due to the methodology of such studies) but, it's the same type of study that's used by vegetarian proponents to push vegetarian eating the vast majority of the time....

This recent review does a good balanced objective job of the topic of what is a very large and complex topic:

Can We Say What Diet Is Best for Health?Annual Review of Public Health

Vol. 35: 83-103 (Volume publication date March 2014)
DOI: 10.1146/annurev-publhealth-032013-182351

The authors conclusion is a classic:


"Food, Not Too Much, Mostly Plants"


Maybe I'm just a nerd, but I LOL'd at that. Smile


Dear Will. I know you are a strong and healthy man from photos you have posted of yourself. I also know you do a lot of exercise from previous postings from you.
   What do you eat ?   ...Oscar
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 Posted 4/5/2014 5:53:56 AM
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oscar2u (4/5/2014)
Will Brink (4/2/2014)



To be clear, such a study has serious limitations as to what can really be concluded from it (due to the methodology of such studies) but, it's the same type of study that's used by vegetarian proponents to push vegetarian eating the vast majority of the time....

This recent review does a good balanced objective job of the topic of what is a very large and complex topic:

Can We Say What Diet Is Best for Health?Annual Review of Public Health

Vol. 35: 83-103 (Volume publication date March 2014)
DOI: 10.1146/annurev-publhealth-032013-182351

The authors conclusion is a classic:


"Food, Not Too Much, Mostly Plants"


Maybe I'm just a nerd, but I LOL'd at that. Smile


Dear Will. I know you are a strong and healthy man from photos you have posted of yourself. I also know you do a lot of exercise from previous postings from you.
   What do you eat ?   ...Oscar


Oscar, I generally follow what I recommend to others: Lean proteins, vegetables (raw and cooked), healthy fats (fish, olive, etc), and high fiber low GI carbs (oatmeal, beans, yams, etc), and some fresh fruit. A balanced omnivores diet, which I follow most of the time, but allow myself "fun" food if the mood hits me. Pizza being a favorite. Satisfied

And of course I have my LEF supplements added to the nutrition and exercise plan.


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 Posted 4/14/2014 7:21:58 PM
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As a veggie myself for close to 4 years now I must say I don't miss meat. I eat eggs and whey (New Zealand stuff is very good) and make sure I get B12 and EPA/DHA. As far as I know those 3 supplements are absolutely vital to anyone considering a veggie diet. You just can't get the correct form from plants.

The old saying "be grateful not gluttonous" is good advice for any type of diet.
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 Posted 5/19/2014 6:49:55 AM
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People who do not eat animal products because of ethical reasons are nuts. The idea that eating animal products is immoral is based on thought disorder, specifically loose association. What would be immoral is if eating animal products, under any circumstances, was eliminated in humans. That would cause starvation and disease and suffering among all humans. What if eating plant products was so eliminated in humans? That would also be nuts, because of terrible effects on humans. Like saying we should kill all humans, including ourselves, to stop global warming. Global warming has many beneficial effects - warmth and energy enable life. Besides, killing all humans in a mass suicide action would have no effect on global warming over the long haul. Variations in solar events causes warming and cooling cycles on earth. 
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 Posted 5/19/2014 6:55:11 AM
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In my opinion, there's no correlation between not eating animals for ethical reasons and the bizarre suggestion of killing all humans to stop global warming.

It would be safe to say that the majority of people who don't eat animals for ethical reasons are not diagnosed with psychoses.


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 Posted 5/19/2014 1:47:37 PM
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People avoiding animal products for ethical reasons do so out of ethical concern, it's really not complicated.

It's taking the basic ethical idea of doing no harm, "do unto others", ethic of reciprocity, what-have-you, and extend it beyond the realm of fellow human beings to other sentient beings. You can reject the assumptions vegetarians make about animals, but outright dismissal of ethical concern as delusion is fairly arrogant.  



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 Posted 5/19/2014 8:22:01 PM
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DDye (5/19/2014)
It would be safe to say that the majority of people who don't eat animals for ethical reasons are not diagnosed with psychoses.


DDye that's an odd statement. Where did you ever get that idea?


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